Comments on: The Jeconiah Curse & Yeshua’s Lineage #33 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/ The Voice of Tsiyon In Exile to the Scattered Remnant of Israel. Wed, 16 May 2012 15:34:23 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=abc By: Jay http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-7000 Jay Mon, 14 May 2012 10:02:19 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-7000 Continuing with the study of Yeshua as the Son of David, in this lesson and the next objections to His being the Son of David which are based on the genealogies found in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 are analyzed and debunked. In this lesson the "curse of Jeconiah" is handled. This objection comes from a superficial reading of Jeremiah 22:24-30 and maintains that Yeshua cannot be eligible for the throne of David, because all of Jeconiah's descendents are excluded from the throne and Jeconiah is an ancestor of Yeshua. A careful reading and analysis yields, however, that it is the land which is being addressed (refer to verse 29). Here is being foretold that Jeconiah will be deported and the people with him. Jeconiah will die in captivity with none of his children (he had 7, by the way) succeeding him on the throne (refer also to verse 30 and note that it is said the he will not succeed in his days). Why would Yahwe speak to the land? There is a special bond between the people of Israel and the land. When Israel is in the land, the land prospers (consider how the land was during all the time of the Gentiles and how it is now), and that is where the people feel at home. This is the land that the Lord has given to them; it should be of no surprise then upon reflection that this bondage exists. The promised of God are not broken. Those who call upon this passage to disallow Yeshua from the throne should not forget that. In His covenant with David, God promised that He would never take His loving kindness from his house as He did with Saul. He would punish "with the rod of man" an errant member of David's family but not take away His loving kindness. Therefore, after the fulfillment of the time of captivity, Zerrubabel, Jeconiah's grandson, was chosen to succeed to the throne of David - not as king, because Judah was still under foreign occupation, but, nonetheless, as the ruler of the people in the land. Reading Haggai 2:20-23, we can see that this has occurred. Here Zerrubabel is referred to as a signet ring, and it is clearly said that the Lord had chosen him. Contrast this with Jeremiah 22:24 where Jeconiah is described as a signet ring which the Lord is taking off and giving to his enemies. Thusly, we see that a careful reading of the passage and consideration of other Scripture and actual history shows how spurious this attack on Yeshua's Kingship is. This also should be a warning to us to not handle Scripture lightly but carefully and prayerfully. My heart does praise the Lord for His mercy and lovingkindness. Continuing with the study of Yeshua as the Son of David, in this lesson and the next objections to His being the Son of David which are based on the genealogies found in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 are analyzed and debunked.

In this lesson the “curse of Jeconiah” is handled. This objection comes from a superficial reading of Jeremiah 22:24-30 and maintains that Yeshua cannot be eligible for the throne of David, because all of Jeconiah’s descendents are excluded from the throne and Jeconiah is an ancestor of Yeshua.

A careful reading and analysis yields, however, that it is the land which is being addressed (refer to verse 29). Here is being foretold that Jeconiah will be deported and the people with him. Jeconiah will die in captivity with none of his children (he had 7, by the way) succeeding him on the throne (refer also to verse 30 and note that it is said the he will not succeed in his days).

Why would Yahwe speak to the land? There is a special bond between the people of Israel and the land. When Israel is in the land, the land prospers (consider how the land was during all the time of the Gentiles and how it is now), and that is where the people feel at home. This is the land that the Lord has given to them; it should be of no surprise then upon reflection that this bondage exists.

The promised of God are not broken. Those who call upon this passage to disallow Yeshua from the throne should not forget that. In His covenant with David, God promised that He would never take His loving kindness from his house as He did with Saul. He would punish “with the rod of man” an errant member of David’s family but not take away His loving kindness.

Therefore, after the fulfillment of the time of captivity, Zerrubabel, Jeconiah’s grandson, was chosen to succeed to the throne of David - not as king, because Judah was still under foreign occupation, but, nonetheless, as the ruler of the people in the land.

Reading Haggai 2:20-23, we can see that this has occurred. Here Zerrubabel is referred to as a signet ring, and it is clearly said that the Lord had chosen him. Contrast this with Jeremiah 22:24 where Jeconiah is described as a signet ring which the Lord is taking off and giving to his enemies.

Thusly, we see that a careful reading of the passage and consideration of other Scripture and actual history shows how spurious this attack on Yeshua’s Kingship is.

This also should be a warning to us to not handle Scripture lightly but carefully and prayerfully.

My heart does praise the Lord for His mercy and lovingkindness.

]]> By: waterfall http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-6609 waterfall Sat, 14 Jan 2012 21:29:04 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-6609 This was new information for me. It's always so amazing how all of these things led up to the time that Yeshua was here on the earth. Everything lines up so perfectly. The Word never contradicts itself, and when you think that it does, you had better study more in depth. I had not heard of this controversy over the curse of Jeconiah, so I'm really glad to be exposed to this teaching so that I will have answers when it does come up. Thank you for the tools that you provide for the remnant. This was new information for me. It’s always so amazing how all of these things led up to the time that Yeshua was here on the earth. Everything lines up so perfectly. The Word never contradicts itself, and when you think that it does, you had better study more in depth.
I had not heard of this controversy over the curse of Jeconiah, so I’m really glad to be exposed to this teaching so that I will have answers when it does come up. Thank you for the tools that you provide for the remnant.

]]> By: Becca4Truth http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-5854 Becca4Truth Fri, 04 Nov 2011 23:54:39 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-5854 This was such a neat lesson. I loved seeing the connection between the Land and the People. I have never myself heard anyone try and discredit Yeshuas lineage. I myself never understood the lineages in the bible. I always read over them, because I could never tie the people together. Its so neat to finally be able to do just that. You are helping me tie these important people together and I'm having a blast seeing it all unfold. I think alot of people, even our scholars in the western world, have a huge problem with Yahweh choosing one nation. Of course the church thinks that Yah has Israel on the back burner right now and His focus is the church, so why worry about Israel< Yah will take care of them in His timing. It makes me wonder if I can trust anyone in the church teaching scripture anymore. I mean how many of our pastors and ministers today have a Hebraic mind-set??? How many look at the bible and say, "this is completely Jewish to the core?" How many say, "I have a Jewish Messiah"? There has to be some out there right? Your right on when you said, "You've got to take on an Israelite mindset to understand Israelite communication". Youve got to think Hebraically to understand Yahweh. Like you said, "the gentiles have rejected the Israelite mindset". This is all so clear. Loved the picture of the signet ring. I'm so glad that I learned this. All we have to do is go back to the covenant and know that Yahweh is faithful to His promises. Did the Scholars forget that when God makes a promise, He never breaks it??? Blessings and Shalom Becca This was such a neat lesson. I loved seeing the connection between the Land and the People.

I have never myself heard anyone try and discredit Yeshuas lineage. I myself never understood the lineages in the bible. I always read over them, because I could never tie the people together. Its so neat to finally be able to do just that. You are helping me tie these important people together and I’m having a blast seeing it all unfold.

I think alot of people, even our scholars in the western world, have a huge problem with Yahweh choosing one nation. Of course the church thinks that Yah has Israel on the back burner right now and His focus is the church, so why worry about Israel< Yah will take care of them in His timing. It makes me wonder if I can trust anyone in the church teaching scripture anymore. I mean how many of our pastors and ministers today have a Hebraic mind-set??? How many look at the bible and say, “this is completely Jewish to the core?” How many say, “I have a Jewish Messiah”? There has to be some out there right?
Your right on when you said, “You’ve got to take on an Israelite mindset to understand Israelite communication”. Youve got to think Hebraically to understand Yahweh. Like you said, “the gentiles have rejected the Israelite mindset”. This is all so clear.

Loved the picture of the signet ring. I’m so glad that I learned this. All we have to do is go back to the covenant and know that Yahweh is faithful to His promises. Did the Scholars forget that when God makes a promise, He never breaks it???

Blessings and Shalom
Becca

]]> By: James L http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-4539 James L Sat, 15 Jan 2011 22:02:48 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-4539 The teaching in this program helped me to have a fuller understanding of how man is connected to the land. I've read in the prophets how the land expelled the people for thier wickedness and polluting the Sabbath. In modern times when Israel became a nation the rainfall increased and the land is reviving from a desert to a fertile land. Another important lesson I received from this teaching is how we need to conform our minds to the word of God in order for us to receive the blessing of being grafted in. I've known for a long time the importance of conforming and renewing our minds but this teaching goes further to show how we must conform in the area of gaining a Hebraic mindset and discarding the Greco-Roman mindset. The different uses of Jechoniah's name answered questions I had about the different uses of names in the sciptures. The teaching in this program helped me to have a fuller understanding of how man is connected to the land. I’ve read in the prophets how the land expelled the people for thier wickedness and polluting the Sabbath. In modern times when Israel became a nation the rainfall increased and the land is reviving from a desert to a fertile land. Another important lesson I received from this teaching is how we need to conform our minds to the word of God in order for us to receive the blessing of being grafted in. I’ve known for a long time the importance of conforming and renewing our minds but this teaching goes further to show how we must conform in the area of gaining a Hebraic mindset and discarding the Greco-Roman mindset. The different uses of Jechoniah’s name answered questions I had about the different uses of names in the sciptures.

]]> By: donjuls http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-4295 donjuls Thu, 04 Nov 2010 12:07:01 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-4295 I love your explanation of Israelite history & mindset, and how it easily displaces the gentile church doctrine and gentile arguments against Yeshua. I also love the process of learning to think as a Hebrew. As alsways I love to learn the truth about Yahweh, Yeshua and the land that He gave His children. Shalom, Don I love your explanation of Israelite history & mindset, and how it easily displaces the gentile church doctrine and gentile arguments against Yeshua. I also love the process of learning to think as a Hebrew.
As alsways I love to learn the truth about Yahweh, Yeshua and the land that He gave His children.

Shalom,

Don

]]> By: gilahinYah http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3783 gilahinYah Tue, 20 Jul 2010 21:58:36 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3783 I remember reading a passage of scripture a long time ago, where it is located, I can not remember right now; but, the thing that really caught my attention was that it was a warning to the inhabitants of a land. The gist of the scripture was this, if the inhabitants did such and such, the land would spew them out... Also, some time in history the people of the land were spewed out because the leaders forsake the commandment about letting the land rest, and it lay desolate for a period of time, until Yahweh restored the people to the land. Thanks for clearing up this misconception about the "curse" of Jeconiah. It certainly makes sense in context with the rest of the passage and other scripture. The natural man receives not the things of the Ruach of Elohim; neither can he know them, for they are spiritually discerned... When people try and intrepret scripture with the natural mind, it can not be good. I remember reading a passage of scripture a long time ago, where it is located, I can not remember right now; but, the thing that really caught my attention was that it was a warning to the inhabitants of a land. The gist of the scripture was this, if the inhabitants did such and such, the land would spew them out…
Also, some time in history the people of the land were spewed out because the leaders forsake the commandment about letting the land rest, and it lay desolate for a period of time, until Yahweh restored the people to the land.
Thanks for clearing up this misconception about the “curse” of Jeconiah. It certainly makes sense in context with the rest of the passage and other scripture.
The natural man receives not the things of the Ruach of Elohim; neither can he know them, for they are spiritually discerned… When people try and intrepret scripture with the natural mind, it can not be good.

]]> By: Shix http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3387 Shix Fri, 19 Feb 2010 02:47:32 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3387 When you read the scriptures, how they are meant to read, the prose and the verses, will come alive for thee! The Hebrew book writ in Hebraic mindset, can not be Americanized and still be correct! One must think, from the beginning to the very end, in order for scripture, to more better comprehend! When gentiles are grafted, it's a mindset change, conforming to the Bible, will seem kind of strange! A paradigm shift to think Hebraically, think the way it was written, historically! The scriptures are truth, it's a matter of fact, regarding these truths, may require some tact! For as Paul has told us, in his writings so bold, the Jews are blessed,and given the Oracles of old! For the Old they may be, but still they are truth, Yeshua does confirm, what better proof! When you read the scriptures, how they are meant to read,
the prose and the verses, will come alive for thee!
The Hebrew book writ in Hebraic mindset,
can not be Americanized and still be correct!
One must think, from the beginning to the very end,
in order for scripture, to more better comprehend!
When gentiles are grafted, it’s a mindset change,
conforming to the Bible, will seem kind of strange!
A paradigm shift to think Hebraically,
think the way it was written, historically!
The scriptures are truth, it’s a matter of fact,
regarding these truths, may require some tact!
For as Paul has told us, in his writings so bold,
the Jews are blessed,and given the Oracles of old!
For the Old they may be, but still they are truth,
Yeshua does confirm, what better proof!

]]> By: fredrad http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3164 fredrad Mon, 05 Oct 2009 05:51:37 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3164 I enjoyed this lesson on Jechoniah.This would be a good example of what I call a "Circle" in the Bible.Where you read something in one part ,and find the completion or fufillment in another.Cool that we did the lesson on Zerubbabel in the last few weeks so we knew how this turned out.It is a good thing for us that Yahweh has a track record of Forgiveness with his people.And this is a great example of that. I also read a little further in Jeremiah to 23:7-8{{7"So then the days are coming," declares the Lord."when people will no longer say,'As surely as the Lord lives,who brought the Israelites up out of Egypt.'8but they will say,'As surely as the Lord lives,who brought the descendants of Isreal up out of the land of the North and out of all the countries where he had banished them.' Then they will live in their own land.".}} To see that the Lord moved on, so to speak, from Egypt as to what he wanted people to acknowledge as their state of affairs.The very same state of affairs we find ourselves in now.Weather you are a Jew or Christian you are rooted in Babylon.Which brings me to one of my favorite verses in scripture REV 17:4{"Come out of her,my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not recieve any of her plagues;} This is what Yahweh wants from us now.He wants us to come back to him,if we left.And get to know him more if we didn't leave.Either way we have work to do. Blessings to all and the "Land" of Isreal. Fred I enjoyed this lesson on Jechoniah.This would be a good example of what I call a “Circle” in the Bible.Where you read something in one part ,and find the completion or fufillment in another.Cool that we did the lesson on Zerubbabel in the last few weeks so we knew how this turned out.It is a good thing for us that Yahweh has a track record of Forgiveness with his people.And this is a great example of that.
I also read a little further in Jeremiah to 23:7-8{{7″So then the days are coming,” declares the Lord.”when people will no longer say,’As surely as the Lord lives,who brought the Israelites up out of Egypt.’8but they will say,’As surely as the Lord lives,who brought the descendants of Isreal up out of the land of the North and out of all the countries where he had banished them.’ Then they will live in their own land.”.}}
To see that the Lord moved on, so to speak, from Egypt as to what he wanted people to acknowledge as their state of affairs.The very same state of affairs we find ourselves in now.Weather you are a Jew or Christian you are rooted in Babylon.Which brings me to one of my favorite verses in scripture REV 17:4{”Come out of her,my people,
so that you will not share in her sins,
so that you will not recieve any of her plagues;}

This is what Yahweh wants from us now.He wants us to come back to him,if we left.And get to know him more if we didn’t leave.Either way we have work to do.

Blessings to all and the “Land” of Isreal.
Fred

]]> By: PraiseToYah http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3129 PraiseToYah Fri, 18 Sep 2009 00:23:03 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3129 Thank you for making the connection to the land. I had never seen how important that it is for Israel to be on the land. Yeshua's lineage is becoming more certain as your teachings continue. This information is so important for today when all you hear is that God's Word is not true. I am so excited to see how exact the Scriptures really are! Thank you for making the connection to the land. I had never seen how important that it is for Israel to be on the land. Yeshua’s lineage is becoming more certain as your teachings continue. This information is so important for today when all you hear is that God’s Word is not true. I am so excited to see how exact the Scriptures really are!

]]> By: Christine http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3011 Christine Mon, 18 May 2009 19:00:28 +0000 http://tsiyon.org/jeconiah_curse/#comment-3011 Another informative lesson...thank you for all of the background information on Jeconiah and the scriptures people refer to as the "curse." I have not heard anyone discredit Yahshua due to this, but thoroughly enjoyed the understanding and elaboration of everything about Jeconiah and his relation to the land. I must admit, I did get goosepimples when you discussed the O'Land, O'Land O'Land interpretation....Our Yah is an Awesome Yah down to the detail. To see Zerubabel fulfilling this as well as the rebuilding of the Temple was definitely inspiring. I have heard many lessons of the promises being to the people and the land and I understood them intellectually, but this lesson really brought it to an emotional level about how much our Heavenly Father cares about the land itself. I thought of it in a different light, as "His Creation," and related to how I too get fondly attached to some of my creative things. Anyway, thank you for your insight into the connection of how the land depends on the people as much as the people depend on the land. Shalom, Chris Another informative lesson…thank you for all of the background information on Jeconiah and the scriptures people refer to as the “curse.” I have not heard anyone discredit Yahshua due to this, but thoroughly enjoyed the understanding and elaboration of everything about Jeconiah and his relation to the land. I must admit, I did get goosepimples when you discussed the O’Land, O’Land O’Land interpretation….Our Yah is an Awesome Yah down to the detail. To see Zerubabel fulfilling this as well as the rebuilding of the Temple was definitely inspiring. I have heard many lessons of the promises being to the people and the land and I understood them intellectually, but this lesson really brought it to an emotional level about how much our Heavenly Father cares about the land itself. I thought of it in a different light, as “His Creation,” and related to how I too get fondly attached to some of my creative things. Anyway, thank you for your insight into the connection of how the land depends on the people as much as the people depend on the land.
Shalom,
Chris

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